LicensedWaterproofer I want to thank you for all your helpful advice thus far. You are a great asset to this board and convinced me exterior was the way to go. Although out of my budget from a contractor; I opted to do it make it a DIY. I do have one more question or so.- I have hand dug 15 linear almost to the footing(started to rain so I had to cover up). There is 10 feet on one side of the corner and 5 on the other. Have found cracks in the block that are step like on both sides of the corner working their way toward the corner as they stepped down. It appears the corner might have settled a bit more than the rest of the foundation. Should I take further action on this to sure up the footing? Should I believe the additional settling was from downpouts on that corner just pointing to the ground for years and years and grading toward the house so all the water was esentially headed to that corner? That is where my water primarily comes in from and is the moldiest. Lastly , will their be any ill effects or future problems if I do not dig the entire backside of the house and just repair that one 10'foot section. That is getting backfilled with peagravel and the rest of the undug wall still ha soil so I was just wanting to be clear as to the possibility of damage from the varied lateral pressure on the same wall.

Thanks Again!!
Keith

Keith,

no problem

and doing it yourself, way ta go!

ok, next time your in the 'hole', look at the FOOTING.....IF, i say IF, the footing is cracked (some call it a dropped-footing) then, you 'MIGHT' need/be better off underpinning it/the footing.

IF.....the footing has NO crack(not the wall-the footing) OR, has a very small crack you much-more than likely will be FINE, no need to doanything else. Thats where your answer lies.

Let me add this to above, we have indeed found cracked-footings near corner of footing and after advising homeowner 'what they could do/try if they want' AND, they opted to do NOTHING else, decade++ later, NO further movement/settling! Could it have dropped-cracked a BIT more, yes but we have seen most do Not. Now, this is based on MANY years, not some buncha shtt SOME will tell you who do NOT have these many years SEEING the results and don`t even do the work/basement waterproofing correctly to begin with! boy, they really pizz me off sometimes

some of these self-proclaimed experts have NOT even been in business for more than 7-10 years and only-prefer to do Inside stuff, shtt, how could they REALLY ever know....they don`t. Ok....lol...sry

Further settling could have, might have been causeed from what you say, might have eroded/washed away a lil of the 'soil-support' UNDER the corner of footing, be careful in ANY hole. Settling may have occured from poor-soil compaction around time house was built or, maybe there was water laying down there when built`n soil then settled a lil thus possible cracked footing, this is IF footing is cracked.And underground-roots can certainly cause soil movement/settling etc.

Yes, water can easily enter into and through the crack(s) on 'Outside' of hollow block wall, water then stays inside hollow blocks and enters Inside bsmt at/near cove/cold joint-where bottom of wall and floor meet, and cause mold/efflorescence/paint peeling etc.

Will there be any ill-effects on rest of wall undone etc? Based on all these years of Hands-on Exp, i DOUBT it! Now, is it possible? Sure.

Is it possible the end of the world is near? Is it possible the Det. Lions will win a Super Bowl? lol, sure, quite doubtful- nobody will EVER know 4 certain!

Is there a chance a crack can occur(then leak) in bsmt wall where undone? Sure! Every single bsmt wall in the world runs that risk. To repeat, based on what we have seen over decades......not 2-5-10, not from someone who has never done a waterproofing job/does Inside Systems/has other title/THINKS they know.....you SHOULD be fine. We done MANY just like you are doing and each `n every one is Fine!

Did a few of them have a leak in undone area in coming years? Yes! But MORE often than not, the crack/other opening was......already there/existed, it just opened-widen a lil more and finally allowed water in, no, the wall did NOT move/bow. IF you have tree(s) close to that wall(s) then there ARE, quite likely roots close to/along/against rest--of--wall which may indeed create a crack-leak in future.

Check out the top of 'footing'....see if its cracked and if so, how much....Oh, and when one 'underpins footings' or uses PIERS, there is NO guarantee that the concrete or piers will....stay in place! Yeah, lol, both could also.....SETTLE/move/drop and so, one is right back where they were.This IS the truth, just so folks know. ANYTIME working underground/moving-replacing soil-piering-underpinning can move-settle too and homeowner is out that **$...at that point, its no one`s fault, did all one could, ya know? It`s just SOME try and take advantage of these situations just to SELL the homeowner the piers etc.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: LicensedWaterproofer,

Hello again.

I am going back in the trenches Friday. I will inspect the footing then. I recently drummed up a couple of questions. If you would not mind. I ordered 3/8 peastone is that acceptable or is 5/8 better? Dewitt and Alco roofing product seemed difficult to come buy so I purchased BlackJack(gibson gardner) fibered flashing cement, will this work? Are Karnak products (Karnak web page) any better or equal do Dewitt? is there a Karnak Product you would reccommend? note: there is already some old asphalt on the wall that appears to come off with the shovel, but leaves a tar residue behind.People look @ me like I am nuts when I tell them the project I am working on and what the product is I am looking for ,so they have been no help. It says not to use on rubberized or plastic roofs so I was going to cover it all with tar paper instead of the visqueen, what is your opinion on this. Lastly, Some of the cracks are mortar joints so when they get chilsed they will probably fall completely into or out of the block leaving quite a void. What should I fill that space with? all mortar? What stops it from falling down and in to the block below?

Thank You once again,
You are saving me a ton of money and your input is highly valued.



Keith

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Joker,

Keith,

the Blackjack we have not used but i 'hear' it is fine/ok, just try `n get the 'trowel-grade'--the thickest, NOT the thin-runny stuff. But, if thats all one can find then go with it, apply thicker.

Dunno about Karnak-the-Great,never used/never heard of....didn`t Johnny Carson have a Karnak/Carnak character? lol.....anyways

i don`t know if you did or didn`t mention the age of house....the tar/asphalt ya see is either from(if newer home)....when damproofed OR, if a bit older then someone in past/former owner etc prolly tried to fix that area but obv didn`t do a good job. ANY of it that is loose scrape it off.

When you say...'some of the cracks R mortar joints'.....are ya talking about mortar joints of bricks that are below ground and/or the jojnts between the blocks that are below ground--OR-- mortar joints between bricks that are ABOVE ground/grade? ANY joints BELOW ground are best sealed/filled with hydraulic-cement, Quikrete makes Hyd cement that you should be able to get/find at Hm Depot/builders supply. All ya do is, prepare the joints/cracks/any openings BELOW ground by scraping & brushing off any dirt etc, then mix it with water and fill in/apply. Let set/harden which should not take too long then, apply tar/asphalt over ALL of are/wall excavated....top to bottom AND side to side.

If ya talking about ABOVE ground joints then it`ll depend how wide/big they are. Smaller openings in joints could-be filled with a thick-caulk long as they are above ground, some don`t like that but, whatever. If your worried about the cosmetics/way joints look above ground you could hire someone to tuckpoint `em. What i`m trying to say is, sometimes there are bricks below-ground/on the bsmt wall so i`d use the hyd cement in-over any of that.

Some of those guys out there who do tear downs/tuckpointing are very-very good and of course others won`t be anything close to average/neat as a 10 year old would do, ya know.

..ok, just checked out Karnak site-- looks/appears as though, the 502RC is the one,NOT sure, looks like. again, have not used. The 88R is spray stuff so, NOT that one. I`d think you could apply 6 mil visqueen over the 502, it 'appears' its close to same stuff as Alco/Dewitt. Whichever of those is the thickest `n elastic/flexible. If you fill ALL cracks/openings w/hydraulic cement you can prolly get away with even a thinner coating, just make sure ya pack the crap outta all openings/cracks. See, when others don`t seal/pack/waterproof ALL openings correctly and don`t backfill correctly then, THATS when they can have recurring leaks/problems. Some will excavate part way down,think-assume-were told they can seal a vertical crack that goes all the way down to footing by just sealing the top couple feet, it doesn`t work that way, lol.

oops, almost missed your 'stone' question...any stone/gravel that allows water to travel through is fine so....either is fine.

no problem at all, trying ta help

This message has been edited. Last edited by: LicensedWaterproofer,

OK -

Thanks once again. The house is 50 years old.
Yes, Johnny Carson did do Karnak the Great. fantastic reference.
The Cracks are in the mortar joints for the cinderblock below grade. I thought I was to chisel out all cracks so they are keyed to hold cement. If I chisel @ the joint it will definately all pop out. I can actually see into/out of my basement through these cracks below grade now that the soil is removed. If the joint pops out totally that is a large void in the end of the block. Between the joint and the shape of the block theres probably a 4-5" in air space inside that 1/2" mortar joint. I was unsure how to address preventing the hydraulic cement from just falling in that void and possibly down into the cavity of the block below. I hope I'm explaining this well enough. Thank you again for your quick responses and helping all of us here get things done right. Do you accept donations?

Keith

Keith,

scrape & brush off any loose mortar around the cracks, then make up some hydraulic cement and push-some in and leave rest on outside of cracks, let it set, NO WAY water will enter again, nope. NO need to get way IN-there! It`s the first 2" or so and outside of wall that matters! Its a.....hollow-block-wall,ok?

of course after hyd cement sets you will be applying aspahlt too and you`ll have all/most peastone-gravel against/along entire depth of wall, water will not sit/lay against the wall like it did, know what i mean. It`ll be fine. Make sure any 'above' ground openings are sealed/caulked etc too, if any.

again-i would NOT spend much time screwin` around w/chiseling etc, take off anything loose, brush it good, seal it w/hyd cement etc....
don`t leave that hole open too long `n again, careful in-down there. They do/can collapse, especially if it rains, or if this hole is near/next to neighbors drive. vibrations `n the weight 'could' spell trouble.

No problem at all, just like to see folks get it done-RIGHT! And NOT scammed! Lordy....so many out here.

And since you`ve dug this out and have SEEN the cracks-openings....i believe you can understand How `n Where water/rain FIRST ENTERS INTO a hollow-block wall, eh?

You can understand how once water enters into the cells of blocks it...stays Inside the blocks and drops-through-each course until it enters the lowest block/course....yeah, lol, its called GRAVITY...just in case several of these nitwit Inside creeps are reading this.

And, i`m pretty certain you can also NOW understand that since water-rain is allowed to ENTER from the Outside, it can/could certainly cause mold/efflorescence/paint peeling etc on the inside of basement wall(s), eh?

And, i bet ya also see how RADON and INSECTS can ENTER into the hollow blocks and, once in the blocks it has access to rest of Bsmt/house especially when Inside Co`s drill holes on Inside of hollow blocks and leave gaps-spaces OPEN where wall & floor meet, yes indeed, they sure do.

When did it become OK to allow water in? When did it become OK to allow an INCREASED-Opportunity for mold to grow, for RADON to enter? I`ll tell ya PART of story, lol, when a few of these guys STARTED Their push/advertisments etc, yeah, they got tired of doing it the right way--the harder way and, wanted a much easier means to make MORE money! I have another word or 2 for them but i better not post, huh.

Now, WHYYYY can`t some of these 'self-proclaimed expert' INSIDE people see/get this? Amazing! Too bad you don`t have some of these Home Imp radio show hosts like Haege/Sullivan etc with you, seeing first hand how water etc enters, so that they change their tune on their recommendations to their radio listeners instead of either telling them to raise the grade/longer downspout extensions or call an Inside Co for an Inside drain tile/baseboard system--GRRRR

I`ll ask out loud yet again, just HOW many Bsmt Waterproofing/Foundation jobs have they done AND.....had to actually GUARANTEE over a long/extended period of time?

How many? none-zero? yeah, how could anyone take their recommendations seriously? lol NO Experience!!! God it pzzes me off, can ya tell?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: LicensedWaterproofer,

Ok - got it- lastly the Karnak you reccomended is not readily available. Below is what is readily available, They all seem as if they would do the job. Could you make a reccomendation on what is available. The links are number 1-4 below. Thanks again. I will be sure to follow up when all is complete and I do my first nail biting water hose test.



1234

Keith,

'looks like' 18af will get er done.

Thanks again; been digging all morning; finally hit footing and then..... you guessed it 5 feet of soil collapsed into my trench. had to re dig; got some ply to shore it up. sheesh alot of lost time. Wish me luck- hey just noticed there does not appear to be any drain tile @ the footings or to the side. Is this a huge problem?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Joker,

Keith,

yeah, always have to be aware when digging a hole the bank/soil could cave in, never fall asleep down there....get in-get it waterproofed correctly `n get out `n backfill.

to know/judge where footing will be, go in basement and stand under a bsmt window. 'IF' the bottom of window is at grade/ground-level then THAT is the Depth to-near footing. some windows are underground/below grade a bit so, when standing in basement its important to know how-deep one has to go to footing/bottom of wall.

some homes the builder/subcontractor may not have installed OR, sometimes they lay-place them a bit higher/above footing OR a bit lower AND, NEAR a corner....the tiles are 'usually' layed a bit further AWAY from wall/footing--at corner there is usually an 'elbow-tile', Not a straight piece like others.

Well I hit the footing, then moved to the side and dug another 6 inches down shovel width wide. Will this pose any problem if there is indeed no tile down there? What should be done? Can I still backfill with the peastone even though the water would then run straight down to the footings? Just want to be prepared, with the re-dig setback I will be encroaching on the corner tomorrow.
Also I noticed today inside the basement there are a couple of blocks low on the corner that have water leaching through them. The surface is actually wet on 2 blocks. This water was not present last night. Could it be all the standing and climbing actually squeezed water out of the soil into the block. Hmm.. must be an exterior crack that does not come all the way through. I could fix that from the inside though if need be. , that is if I listened to others and not heeded to your advice. Albiet advice and experience there is alot of logic behind it.
Lastly, where would I send a donation for the time , effort and clear ,concise advise you offer up to us?
Keith

Keith-AKA Joker-

excuse me? listened to others? HAHA! well, call em over right NOW and pay `em if thats what you want to do, you can certainly still do that! what a crock

your first post stated you dug out x amount, found cracks etc.Then your story changes.. FIX-seal the cracks! You/nobody can fix a crack that is on the Outside of a hollow-block wall from.... the Inside.

DRAIN TILES have NOTHING to do, ZERO.....with water that enters through cracks or other openings on the Outside, period end of story. If you/others don`t want to seal/waterproof the cracks/wall correctly on the Outside then you`ll NEVER stop/prevent the darn good possibility of mold/mildew/efflorescence and also won`t stop insects and radon from ENTERING.

And none will ever help lessen/relieve Soil pressure off the outside of wall(s), nope, NOT with ANY Inside System....ever. But, believe what ya like.

YOUR choices, what a

IF.....YOU-anyone have water coming out of the block(s) on the inside of basement...like i`ve said throughout posts, it is due to water Entering blocks from/on the Outside, sheesh.

All one needs to do is drill a few holes in blocks to allow water out of blocks, then seal the holes back up. This is AFTER waterproofing--stopping water from First--ENTERING the blocks through Outside cracks...duh

Look....you come on here and ask questions which i took to be real-true and its obvious that you are most likely one of these Inside bs`rs, wasting my time so, hope you had your fun. I`m soo sick and tired of Inside loser-scamming companies, one of many in Indiana and same goes for OHIO-PENN and at least a handful of others.

Just about every Inside Co and their salespeople are completely full of chtt, some of you will get-it/see-it throughout these posts, they CANNOT answer ANY of the direct questions i`ve asked them over `n over.Whoever wants to hire Garbage like that, go right ahead....lol, if you get estimates from these scammers and wait a couple/few days they`ll actually call you back and say chtt like "oh, we can drop the price of job about $1,000--3,000 if you let us start tomorrow" and other trash...goodnight Irene

This message has been edited. Last edited by: LicensedWaterproofer,

quote:

I could fix that from the inside though if need be. , that is if I listened to others and not heeded to your advice

Apparently you took the above quote the wrong way. I highlighted the important part. I was poking fun @ all the things you see listed in media/on other message boards and what the people tell you that have been called in :note emotioncon with question marks, as in how could that work. There is no belief on my part hence the prior statement. It was a compliment to you.Just to prove to you I'm not pulling anyones leg, here are photos taken today. photos

I apologize if you misunderstood or took offense to my statement. I thought it was clear I was on your side not against you.

Keith

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Joker,

Keith,

i sure did. ya gotta try `n think that several here are not happy with the facts that i post so....not surprising some like to assume different names/nics and play games.its happened here and on other boards and i get tired of the crap,am here to try `n help so, if ya need anything else fire away

I could understand your point. I have seen some of the disputes in the past when I first joined the board and started researching what to do with my problem. Originally I was doing the research on sani-tred and found a message you had had posted disputing another poster. Your points were valid and I started to ask questions then- that was august. Took a while for me to finally get going but I did.The informitive resource you have provided for me has been priceless. Thanks.
Were you serious about drilling holes inside to let the water drain when I finish waterproofing the outside. Is there no real concern if indeed ther is no draintile down there. I should be done digging and patching the cracks today. Hopefully by end of day I can get the tar up and start the backfill. Thanks again for all your assistance. Still haven't answered this question----Where can I send a donation?

Keith

Keith,

Thx for offer but NO need for anything like that, i`m NOT here for ANY money, again thx anyway. Those who know me laugh at things like that, they know i`ve never been in this business for the money, to simply make a tough living, yup. Pay my bills and i`m pretty happy, i don`t seek what some others in this business do, big house/ vacation house outta state/ 3 cars/a nice business building etc etc--LOOKS can be DECEIVING!

ok enough of that chtt,YES...absolutely serious about drilling holes in lower/bottom courses of hollow block walls to.....allow the WATER that has entered and got locked-up inside over the years......OUT.
Let it out and seal holes.

If anyone/yourself would like to call some homeowners who`ll explain this to ya, say the word, they`ll inform ya of their own house.

See, sometimes....water that entered into the hollow blocks over the years gets, like i said, Locked-up Inside the cells of the blocks.

Most think/assume that any wayer that got in there comes out right away....Wrong! Not always. And so, after sealing/waterproofing the problems correctly any water that is locked up should be let out/drained.

Leaving water inside hollow blocks could help deteriorate the inside of blocks over the years AND, cause mold/mildew/sweating of the wall etc.

The outside Drain tiles have Nothing to do with water that enters walls through cracks, anyone who says otherwise does NOT know what their talking about, sorry, but thats the truth!

Could-might drain tiles laid around the footing..HELP take 'some' water away? Sure, but again....it has nothing to do with water/rain that gets in the soil around homes, percolates `n wicks/travels sideways AND down through the soil and enters through the darn cracks `n other openings.

NO drain tile that is laid/placed ANYWHERE, whether its just below ground level or along footings is going to.....carry/keep all the water in the soil away, it just doesn`t work that way, some would like to believe that and DO....its easier for them to believe/think that i guess. Can`t show/explain every single detail of all the jobs/means/ways/remedys/screw ups etc to folks, its not possible but we try

Cracks in walls and openings above-ground are just that, and need to be sealed/waterproofed correctly BUT, sometimes a few homeowners will have a....2-part problem, yeah, 2 ways where water is entering.

One of those possibilities is some will have cracks on outside of hollow blocks AND, a problem-a blockage UNDER the basement floor. So, they`ll need 2 different things done-correctly to SOLVE their...problemSSS, see what i mean? Basement leaks need to be defined FIRST-by someone who really IS an expert and who is honest-before spending any money...then they will know what is necessary to solve leak(s).

OK trench is filled. Fell short on some peastone due to the uncalculated wall collapse. So I am about 2 feet below grade- I have 2 questions- 1) do I order more gravel to come closer to grade? 2) do I put down landscape fabric on top of the stone before the topsoil?

Thanks again

Keith

Keith,

good man.

as for being a lil short you could, order more gravel or fill rest if ya have enough top soil/sand.

i would backfill w/gravel cuz of the crack(s) you said existed. any vertical or step crack starts/is near TOP of wall so its BEST to place as much gravel there as possible for Full/immediate drainage for years to come.

Fabric is up to you, we do Not. either way it may settle a lil in coming months, especially since ya had cave in/soil collapsed. Your choice

LWP-

Thanks again. I have more peastone coming on friday. I guess this will all be put to the test starting tonight as it is supposed to rain through thursday. I do have a concern - as I was inspecting from inside the home, the cracks I could once see daylight through, I noted an odor of tar. Now I understand I put lots of tar on the wall but I d